HDA HDMI PCM device allocation
Hi,
I am trying to fix some issues in UCM for the HDA HDMI devices [1][2]. I would like to summary the current situation at first (correct me, if I miss something):
We have two methods to map the PINs in the HDA HDMI driver to the PCM devices (legacy/static - 1:1 mapping, dynamic - used for new devices with the MST capability). There is also set of converters in each HDMI codec and the number of simultaneously used PCM devices cannot go beyond this count of converters in hardware (otherwise -EBUSY error is returned). The count of converters is 3 or 4 depending on the hardware.
Things to discuss:
It seems quite straight to limit the count of created PCMs to the count of converters. We cannot use more anyway and it does not help, if more PCM devices are allocated (and Jacks reported) to applications when they cannot be used simultaneously.
Legacy/static mapping should be converted to dynamic (unless the count of created PCM devices is equal to the count of codec converters).
There may be 1:1 mapping between the converter and the PCM device to make things easier.
There is a corner case, when more HDMI devices are connected than the count of converters. In this case, an extra method (a module parameter and/or a control element and/or procfs) may be used to filter unwanted HDMI devices. It may be a bit difficult to select the proper filtering key - it may be the PIN/MST device hash or so. The driver may report this key in eld#* files (procfs).
Impact to applications:
Those days, pulseaudio or pipewire servers are mostly used on the current hardware. Both servers share the legacy probe code for HDMI devices - they are trying to open PCM devices sequentially and check for the error code. There should not be a problem when the connected HDMI devices do not go beyond the count of converters. A minor issue is that the name of the used sink/port may be different (users may be forced to reselect the output path).
For other applications, the PCM device assigned to the connected HDMI device may be different (available in a different ALSA device name). I do not think that it's a big issue. It should be easy solvable with an updated software configuration.
Let me know about your opinion about this.
Thank you, Jaroslav
[1] https://github.com/alsa-project/alsa-lib/issues/245 [2] https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/pipewire/pipewire/-/issues/2481
Hi,
On Mon, 19 Sep 2022, Jaroslav Kysela wrote:
We have two methods to map the PINs in the HDA HDMI driver to the PCM devices (legacy/static - 1:1 mapping, dynamic - used for new devices with the MST capability). There is also set of converters in each HDMI codec and the number of simultaneously used PCM devices cannot go beyond this count of converters in hardware (otherwise -EBUSY error is returned). The count of converters is 3 or 4 depending on the hardware.
roughly yes. There is some further details and variation in implementation the dynamic method if you look at patch_hdmi.c:generic_hdmi_build_pcms(). E.g. recently we added 'dyn_pcm_no_legacy' to start limiting the amount of PCM nodes created. But yeah, this is exactly to move to the direction you are proposing.
Things to discuss:
It seems quite straight to limit the count of created PCMs to the count of converters. We cannot use more anyway and it does not help, if more PCM devices are allocated (and Jacks reported) to applications when they cannot be used simultaneously.
5~Agreed. When the amount of HDA pins (~= possible physical ports) was small, and before DP-MST (or when DP-MST was available only on a small subset of physical ports), there was clear value in having sticky PIN-to-PCMx mapping. If you plugged a monitor to certain HDMI or DP port, it would show up in the same PCM node. If you had a DP-MST hub, the monitor/receivers behind the hub, would also end up mapped to the familiar ALSA PCM nodes.
But especially with USB-C, the # of possible topologies has shot up (basicly any port can host a DP-MST hub), making this approach less and less practical.
With SOF, we had further constraints in integrating with ASoC, so we've basicly limited PCM (FE) nodes to number of converters (PCM BEs) from the start. Now with dyn_pcm_no_legacy, this starts to be used also with non-DSP usage via snd-hda-intel (with Intel Tiger Lake and newer). At least so far we've not got any negative feedback on this, so road seems clear to move ahead with this approach. There is certainly a lot of cruft in the code to maintain all the legacy options.
There is a corner case, when more HDMI devices are connected than the count of converters. In this case, an extra method (a module parameter and/or a control element and/or procfs) may be used to filter unwanted HDMI devices. It may be
At least on Intel platforms this is not a problem. The number of converters is aligned with number of display pipes. So you'll never have more HDMI devices connected than the max number of converters.
Impact to applications:
Those days, pulseaudio or pipewire servers are mostly used on the current hardware. Both servers share the legacy probe code for HDMI devices - they are trying to open PCM devices sequentially and check for the error code. There
5~> should not be a problem when the connected HDMI devices do not go beyond the
count of converters. A minor issue is that the name of the used sink/port may be different (users may be forced to reselect the output path).
For other applications, the PCM device assigned to the connected HDMI device may be different (available in a different ALSA device name). I do not think that it's a big issue. It should be easy solvable with an updated software configuration.
Ack, and this model is already required for smooth integration. With snd-hda-intel, while PCM routing tries to maintain legacy PCM mapping, it cannot be guaranteed in all possible cases. On systems using SOF, there's no legacy mapping at all.
So the right (and robust) approach for apps to select the PCM for HDMI/DP audio is to use: - UCM tells which kcontrol to monitor for jack event - JackControl "HDMI/DP,pcm=3 Jack" - Jack control tells whether receiver is connected or not - "numid=22,iface=CARD,name='HDMI/DP,pcm=3 Jack'" - the ELD data describes receiver properties - "numid=27,iface=PCM,name='ELD',device=3"
The above is done by Pulseaudio when UCM is used (and followed by Pipewire) and CRAS on ChromeOS. The above can give user sensible GUI information on where to route the audio, and provide enough tools for applications to provide persistancy (audio is routed to Foobar XYZ monitor always, indepedently of the order in which the display/receivers are discovered).
In simple setups (one HDMI/DP receiver with audio capability connected), the receiver is always connected to the first HDMI/DP PCM of the card.
Br, Kai
Jaroslav,
thanks for bringing the issue. I follow up onto Kai's reply.
On Mon, 19 Sep 2022 19:43:28 +0200, Kai Vehmanen wrote:
Hi,
On Mon, 19 Sep 2022, Jaroslav Kysela wrote:
We have two methods to map the PINs in the HDA HDMI driver to the PCM devices (legacy/static - 1:1 mapping, dynamic - used for new devices with the MST capability). There is also set of converters in each HDMI codec and the number of simultaneously used PCM devices cannot go beyond this count of converters in hardware (otherwise -EBUSY error is returned). The count of converters is 3 or 4 depending on the hardware.
roughly yes. There is some further details and variation in implementation the dynamic method if you look at patch_hdmi.c:generic_hdmi_build_pcms(). E.g. recently we added 'dyn_pcm_no_legacy' to start limiting the amount of PCM nodes created. But yeah, this is exactly to move to the direction you are proposing.
Things to discuss:
It seems quite straight to limit the count of created PCMs to the count of converters. We cannot use more anyway and it does not help, if more PCM devices are allocated (and Jacks reported) to applications when they cannot be used simultaneously.
5~Agreed. When the amount of HDA pins (~= possible physical ports) was small, and before DP-MST (or when DP-MST was available only on a small subset of physical ports), there was clear value in having sticky PIN-to-PCMx mapping. If you plugged a monitor to certain HDMI or DP port, it would show up in the same PCM node. If you had a DP-MST hub, the monitor/receivers behind the hub, would also end up mapped to the familiar ALSA PCM nodes.
But especially with USB-C, the # of possible topologies has shot up (basicly any port can host a DP-MST hub), making this approach less and less practical.
With SOF, we had further constraints in integrating with ASoC, so we've basicly limited PCM (FE) nodes to number of converters (PCM BEs) from the start. Now with dyn_pcm_no_legacy, this starts to be used also with non-DSP usage via snd-hda-intel (with Intel Tiger Lake and newer). At least so far we've not got any negative feedback on this, so road seems clear to move ahead with this approach. There is certainly a lot of cruft in the code to maintain all the legacy options.
Yes, and I thought this flag should suffice and provide the dynamic assignment feature, if it's set to every new model in future as default (at least about the converters)?
There is a corner case, when more HDMI devices are connected than the count of converters. In this case, an extra method (a module parameter and/or a control element and/or procfs) may be used to filter unwanted HDMI devices. It may be
At least on Intel platforms this is not a problem. The number of converters is aligned with number of display pipes. So you'll never have more HDMI devices connected than the max number of converters.
I guess it's true in general that a converter corresponds to an output for all graphics implementations, so far. Of course, it's not set on stone, so things may change. But I'm afraid that it'll be beyond the HD-audio codec itself.
Impact to applications:
Those days, pulseaudio or pipewire servers are mostly used on the current hardware. Both servers share the legacy probe code for HDMI devices - they are trying to open PCM devices sequentially and check for the error code. There
5~> should not be a problem when the connected HDMI devices do not go beyond the
count of converters. A minor issue is that the name of the used sink/port may be different (users may be forced to reselect the output path).
For other applications, the PCM device assigned to the connected HDMI device may be different (available in a different ALSA device name). I do not think that it's a big issue. It should be easy solvable with an updated software configuration.
Ack, and this model is already required for smooth integration. With snd-hda-intel, while PCM routing tries to maintain legacy PCM mapping, it cannot be guaranteed in all possible cases. On systems using SOF, there's no legacy mapping at all.
So the right (and robust) approach for apps to select the PCM for HDMI/DP audio is to use:
- UCM tells which kcontrol to monitor for jack event
- JackControl "HDMI/DP,pcm=3 Jack"
- Jack control tells whether receiver is connected or not
- "numid=22,iface=CARD,name='HDMI/DP,pcm=3 Jack'"
- the ELD data describes receiver properties
- "numid=27,iface=PCM,name='ELD',device=3"
The above is done by Pulseaudio when UCM is used (and followed by Pipewire) and CRAS on ChromeOS. The above can give user sensible GUI information on where to route the audio, and provide enough tools for applications to provide persistancy (audio is routed to Foobar XYZ monitor always, indepedently of the order in which the display/receivers are discovered).
In simple setups (one HDMI/DP receiver with audio capability connected), the receiver is always connected to the first HDMI/DP PCM of the card.
Sounds reasonable to me.
thanks,
Takashi
participants (3)
-
Jaroslav Kysela -
Kai Vehmanen -
Takashi Iwai