Re: [alsa-devel] alsa-devel on vger
On Thu, 22 Nov 2007, Takashi Iwai wrote:
At Wed, 21 Nov 2007 20:14:34 +0100 (CET), Jaroslav Kysela wrote:
On Wed, 21 Nov 2007, Rene Herman wrote:
On 21-11-07 17:54, Takashi Iwai wrote:
What about the plan to move alsa-devel to vger? Shouldn't we do that soon?
Jaroslav hasn't yet pointed alsa-devel@alsa-project.org at vger. It's a little unfortunate that David wouldn't just transfer subscriptions as it seems that's where things stalled again. Given our still recent move from sourceforge it really should be okay to just move everyone over.
I noticed that the entirety of people thanking David for setting up the list consisted of alsa-devel moderators, you and me, and I suspect most other subscribers don't feel there's actually much wrong with things as they are today and mostly consider moving again a nuisance. The one other reaction to the move was a slightly annoyed reaction about the re-subscribing...
I'm playing with idea to redirect alsa-devel@alsa-project.org to vger and leave current mailing list (which is subscribed to vger now too). So every e-mail to this list will go through vger, and resubscription will be only choice of subscriber. Opinions?
A couple of things:
- the official address (on kernel tree and wiki) should be vger, not alsa-project.org, and promote to re-subscribe.
Changing e-mail address of list is something I don't want. The official e-mail address for alsa-devel mailing list was always alsa-devel@alsa-project.org (even in time when this list was on sourceforge). Unfortunately, vger mailing list does not accept simple redirected e-mails from alsa-devel@alsa-project.org so I postponed any actions.
- open alsa-project.org list again. I'll stop list admin works.
I tried to count some statistics and at the time spamassassin and mailman filtering rules catch 92% of spam messages coming to alsa-devel. Unfortunately remaining 8% means 20 spam messages daily (without moderation). Could moderators confirm this value?
Jaroslav
----- Jaroslav Kysela perex@perex.cz Linux Kernel Sound Maintainer ALSA Project
On 25-11-07 19:27, Jaroslav Kysela wrote:
On Thu, 22 Nov 2007, Takashi Iwai wrote:
A couple of things:
- the official address (on kernel tree and wiki) should be vger, not alsa-project.org, and promote to re-subscribe.
Changing e-mail address of list is something I don't want. The official e-mail address for alsa-devel mailing list was always alsa-devel@alsa-project.org (even in time when this list was on sourceforge). Unfortunately, vger mailing list does not accept simple redirected e-mails from alsa-devel@alsa-project.org so I postponed any actions.
I can sort of sympathise with wanting to keep the name, but well, Takashi is the most productive person in ALSA and I'd say that lessening his burdens is quite a priority in itself, so what need be, need be.
I myself said that I don't terribly mind the moderating, but I certainly wouldn't miss it either. I originally volunteered for a few weeks...
Possible to arrange with David Miller that the old name will still work?
- open alsa-project.org list again. I'll stop list admin works.
I tried to count some statistics and at the time spamassassin and mailman filtering rules catch 92% of spam messages coming to alsa-devel. Unfortunately remaining 8% means 20 spam messages daily (without moderation). Could moderators confirm this value?
No, has too be significantly more, although it varies somewhat per day. But I alone moderate out more than that on average and I'm not alone. Are there no "discarded messages" statistic available from the moderation interface?
Rene.
On Sun, 25 Nov 2007, Rene Herman wrote:
I tried to count some statistics and at the time spamassassin and mailman filtering rules catch 92% of spam messages coming to alsa-devel. Unfortunately remaining 8% means 20 spam messages daily (without moderation). Could moderators confirm this value?
No, has too be significantly more, although it varies somewhat per day. But I alone moderate out more than that on average and I'm not alone. Are there no "discarded messages" statistic available from the moderation interface?
_From mailman logs (May 04 - today):
Total held messages: 2922 (including approved ones) Approved held messages: 419
Also note that ~143 held messages were approved on Nov 14 and Nov 15 (CCed thread from LKML - New Kernel Bugs).
I hope that all moderators are receiving notification about held messages, so it's no a problem to just check a list and login to mailman interface only when a non-spam (or not clear) message is on the list. I just configured mailman that all messages older than 4 days will be automatically discarded.
Jaroslav
----- Jaroslav Kysela perex@perex.cz Linux Kernel Sound Maintainer ALSA Project
On 25-11-07 20:46, Jaroslav Kysela wrote:
On Sun, 25 Nov 2007, Rene Herman wrote:
I tried to count some statistics and at the time spamassassin and mailman filtering rules catch 92% of spam messages coming to alsa-devel. Unfortunately remaining 8% means 20 spam messages daily (without moderation). Could moderators confirm this value?
No, has too be significantly more, although it varies somewhat per day. But I alone moderate out more than that on average and I'm not alone. Are there no "discarded messages" statistic available from the moderation interface?
From mailman logs (May 04 - today):
Total held messages: 2922 (including approved ones) Approved held messages: 419
That would be (2922 - 419) / ($-20070504) ~= 12/day. I'll pay attention for a bit, but that really doesn't sound right...
Also note that ~143 held messages were approved on Nov 14 and Nov 15 (CCed thread from LKML - New Kernel Bugs).
I hope that all moderators are receiving notification about held messages, so it's no a problem to just check a list and login to mailman interface only when a non-spam (or not clear) message is on the list. I just configured mailman that all messages older than 4 days will be automatically discarded.
I get them at least. You are a bit quick in snipping the arguments before this though. Did you try asking David Miller if the list could be at vger while keeping the alsa-devel@alsa-project.org name going?
Rene.
On 25-11-07 21:27, Rene Herman wrote:
On 25-11-07 20:46, Jaroslav Kysela wrote:
From mailman logs (May 04 - today):
Total held messages: 2922 (including approved ones) Approved held messages: 419
That would be (2922 - 419) / ($-20070504) ~= 12/day. I'll pay attention for a bit, but that really doesn't sound right...
Assuming noone else deleted any either, 32 since approximately this time yesterday which sounds better (for days without any specific spamruns).
I'm generally logged in to the thing all day long, so perhaps I've skewed the statistics by being too quick to get to some? Anyways, doesn't really matter...
Rene.
At Sun, 25 Nov 2007 19:27:38 +0100 (CET), Jaroslav Kysela wrote:
On Thu, 22 Nov 2007, Takashi Iwai wrote:
At Wed, 21 Nov 2007 20:14:34 +0100 (CET), Jaroslav Kysela wrote:
On Wed, 21 Nov 2007, Rene Herman wrote:
On 21-11-07 17:54, Takashi Iwai wrote:
What about the plan to move alsa-devel to vger? Shouldn't we do that soon?
Jaroslav hasn't yet pointed alsa-devel@alsa-project.org at vger. It's a little unfortunate that David wouldn't just transfer subscriptions as it seems that's where things stalled again. Given our still recent move from sourceforge it really should be okay to just move everyone over.
I noticed that the entirety of people thanking David for setting up the list consisted of alsa-devel moderators, you and me, and I suspect most other subscribers don't feel there's actually much wrong with things as they are today and mostly consider moving again a nuisance. The one other reaction to the move was a slightly annoyed reaction about the re-subscribing...
I'm playing with idea to redirect alsa-devel@alsa-project.org to vger and leave current mailing list (which is subscribed to vger now too). So every e-mail to this list will go through vger, and resubscription will be only choice of subscriber. Opinions?
A couple of things:
- the official address (on kernel tree and wiki) should be vger, not alsa-project.org, and promote to re-subscribe.
Changing e-mail address of list is something I don't want. The official e-mail address for alsa-devel mailing list was always alsa-devel@alsa-project.org (even in time when this list was on sourceforge). Unfortunately, vger mailing list does not accept simple redirected e-mails from alsa-devel@alsa-project.org so I postponed any actions.
- open alsa-project.org list again. I'll stop list admin works.
I tried to count some statistics and at the time spamassassin and mailman filtering rules catch 92% of spam messages coming to alsa-devel. Unfortunately remaining 8% means 20 spam messages daily (without moderation). Could moderators confirm this value?
The problem is rather the nature of subscribers-only list. It requires approval if any non-list user posts. So when the list is CC'ed, you'll need more approval works and loose the synchronism.
BTW, it seems that some my posts have been lost in a day that alsa-devel ML stopped. The above quoted post seems not delivered unless you were on Cc...
Takashi
On Mon, 26 Nov 2007, Takashi Iwai wrote:
The problem is rather the nature of subscribers-only list. It requires approval if any non-list user posts. So when the list is CC'ed, you'll need more approval works and loose the synchronism.
True, but I think that relevant developers are CCed directly in most cases, so the delay is not big.
Anyway, I don't think that we have problem with mailman on alsa-devel@alsa-project.org, but with spam filter for incoming e-mails.
David, would be possible to let vger just filter our incoming e-mails? I can redirect alsa-devel@alsa-project.org to a vger e-mail address and vger might return filtered e-mails back to alsa-devel-incoming@alsa-project.org ? Then we can open current mailing list without bothering subscribers. Thank you for your reply.
Jaroslav
----- Jaroslav Kysela perex@perex.cz Linux Kernel Sound Maintainer ALSA Project
On 26-11-07 09:11, Jaroslav Kysela wrote:
On Mon, 26 Nov 2007, Takashi Iwai wrote:
The problem is rather the nature of subscribers-only list. It requires approval if any non-list user posts. So when the list is CC'ed, you'll need more approval works and loose the synchronism.
True, but I think that relevant developers are CCed directly in most cases, so the delay is not big.
Anyway, I don't think that we have problem with mailman on alsa-devel@alsa-project.org, but with spam filter for incoming e-mails.
David, would be possible to let vger just filter our incoming e-mails? I can redirect alsa-devel@alsa-project.org to a vger e-mail address and vger might return filtered e-mails back to alsa-devel-incoming@alsa-project.org ? Then we can open current mailing list without bothering subscribers. Thank you for your reply.
David?
Rene.
participants (3)
-
Jaroslav Kysela -
Rene Herman -
Takashi Iwai